NEED SOME COAX ADVICE ON A 2X8 INSTALL PLEASE

#203710

I'M GOING TO MOUNT/ INSTALL MY 2X8 IN MY 2002 379 PETERBILT SOON BUT I NEED SOMEONE WITH EXPERIENCE IN THIS TYPE INSTALL TO CONSULT WITH SO I CAN MAKE USE OF ALL THE LASTEST COAX UPGRADES,ANTENNA MOUNTING SOLUTIONS. IM INSTALLING A TEXAS STAR DX1600V .
WHAT ARE THE CURRENT ACCEPTABLE COAX CHOICES FOR THIS PROJECT?? MY RESEARCH SAYS RG-213 & LMR 400. OF THESE 2 CHOICES , WHICH IS MORE PLYABLE/ BENDABLE OR MANAGABLE TO WORK WITH?? WHICH IS THE SMALLER IN SIZE?? I HAVE BEEN USING 8X FOR YEARS ON MY 1X4 AND EVEN MY OLD 1X6.

#203853

edited/ bump/

backwoods · #203855

I think (warning I do not do this well) there are two versions of LMR400. One is a flex version and the other is stiffer. I am going to upgrade my truck to 213 because I have it and do not have to make any tight bends. Maybe someone that thinks better than me will chime in!

#203867

I am currently running rg-213 in my dually with my tx 350 into the ts dx1600, even as my jumpers. I dont have my lmr 400uf yet but i suspect it will be about as stiff as the 213, as they are near the same size diameter (i think). lmr 400 is double shielded from what i am gathering. just make sure you use the ultra flex (uf).

#203869

The lmr400 flex and the rg213 to me are very much the same. When you go from the regular 400 to the flex, the center conductor changes. The regular has about a #10 solid center and the flex has a multi stranded one. On the flex I usually, when putting on connectors, cut a couple of strands away and file them for best fit and conductivity. On the regular 400, i just file the center to where it fits and solders nicely. Both are more than adequate and I've even ran 8x in the past will no ill effect up to about a kw, but in my install the coax doesn't move so I went with the bigger but I'm sure the smaller 120 or 240 would suffice for most installs, especially on the one coming from the radio to the first amp and from the first driver to a main amp as power is less than a kw typically on those runs. -drdx

linx · #203875

The LMR 400 is better quality, but the RG213 is more flexible than the LMR 400 and LMR 400 UF. The RG213 has more of a rubbery outside jacket whereas thet LMR has a thick hard plastic coating. The RG213 also has a single shield which provides easier bending. The RG213 also has a foam insulator whereas the LMR 400 has a thick plastic feeling insulator.

Both coaxes are EXCELLENT! I run both on my base, and am happy with both. The LMR 400 will probably handle more power, even if it's the stranded (UF) version and not solid core, but I'm sure the LMR 400 has a 20 year UV shelf life.

For making sharp turns and bends, the 213 beats the LMR hands down, even the UF. Times Microwave has superior quality and I don't think they screw up often makin the LMR 400.

#203877

[quote="SARGE"]I am currently running rg-213 in my dually with my tx 350 into the ts dx1600, even as my jumpers. I dont have my lmr 400uf yet but i suspect it will be about as stiff as the 213, as they are near the same size diameter (i think). lmr 400 is double shielded from what i am gathering. just make sure you use the ultra flex (uf).[/quote] WHAT WOULD ONE GAIN BY USING LMR400UF OVER THE RG-213?? ALSO WOULD IT HURT TO RUN THE RG-8X FROM THE RADIO TO THE AMP?? I HAVE HEARD THAT YOU SHOULDNT MIX COAX BUT I HAVE TIGHT TURNS AND WILL BE PRETTY LONG TO THE AMP. I WILL ONLY USE THE RG-213 or LMR400 FROM AMP ON TO ANTENNA BUT I'M ALSO CONCERNED WITH THE METER COAX AS WELL. I WOULD LIKE TO FIND AN INLINE WATT/SWR METER THAT I DONT HAVE TO RUN MILES OF COAX ALL OVER THE PLACE FOR.

linx · #203879

Mix and match doesn't matter as long as the coax is 50ohms.

I've got Andrews Heliax on my tower. At the top of the tower it changes from the Heliax to LMR 400 on 1 beam and RG213 on another beam. My jumpers are all LMR 400, and under my house I have 2 runs of RG213 that go from my lightning arrestors to my radio. I've never had any issue mixing 50ohm coax's. When you have multiple connections, you can get insertion loss, but if you make long strait runs, then you'll be just fine.

One more thing about what Sarge said. The LMR 400 and the LMR 400UF are both stiffer than RG213. I'm not saying 213 is the most flexible thing on earth, but the insulator on the LMR and the outer jacket on the LMR makes for stiff coax.

#203885

[quote="drdx"]The lmr400 flex and the rg213 to me are very much the same. When you go from the regular 400 to the flex, the center conductor changes. The regular has about a #10 solid center and the flex has a multi stranded one. On the flex I usually, when putting on connectors, cut a couple of strands away and file them for best fit and conductivity. On the regular 400, i just file the center to where it fits and solders nicely. Both are more than adequate and I've even ran 8x in the past will no ill effect up to about a kw, but in my install the coax doesn't move so I went with the bigger but I'm sure the smaller 120 or 240 would suffice for most installs, especially on the one coming from the radio to the first amp and from the first driver to a main amp as power is less than a kw typically on those runs. -drdx[/quote] OK DR.DX YOUR THE MAN I NEEDED TO ASK ANYWAY........I HAVE THAT SELF CONTAINED ....ALL IN ONE BOX TEXAS STAR DX1600V W/ THE BUILT IN DRIVER. I'M NOT PLANNING ON HAMMERING IT. JUST GONNA RUN MY GEN.LEE OR BYPASS THE DRIVER AND USE MY 95T . NOW WILL NEW RG-8X WORK ON THIS SETUP?? I USED IT ON MY 1X6 BOX AND HAD NO ISSUES.

THANKS TO ALL YOU FOLKS FOR HE INSIGHT AND HELP. I CANT DO BUT 1 QUOTE CAUSE I'M ON MY CELL PHONE AND HAV E LIMITED FEATURE USE AND CANT DO MULTIPLE QUOTES/ ANSWERS AT THE SAME TIME.
I SAW WHERE 3-4 OF YOU RESPONDED WHILEI WAS ANSWERNG THE FIRST RESPONSE........ITS VERY VERY SLOW WORKING OFF THIS CELL PHONE BUT IM GRATEFUL I CAN AT LEAST USEIT ON THE SITE NOW. THATS A GREAT RELIEF .

#203893

[quote="linx"]Mix and match doesn't matter as long as the coax is 50ohms..[/quote]
WILL A FRESH RUN OF 8X WORK FOR ALL OF IT OR IS IT TO LIGHT IN THE AZZ FOR THE WATTS COMING OUT OF THE 2X8???

KW KID · #203895

Rg8x spec = [Please login or register to view this link]

Looks like its rated 1kw @ 10MHZ, and approx. 600 watts @27Mhz. Probably not the best choice. Go with RG-213.

213 spec = [Please login or register to view this link]

Looks like its rated for approximately 1800 watts @ around 27Mhz. Note, the rating is for carrier (real watts). Your 8 pill is not going to put out near that.

I'm saving you the time in figuring out what to use, use RG-213. I'm an EXTRA class ham telling you so! I know you just want a clear answer, not a novel.

#203897

You'd have to look at the specs, but I think 8x is only rated for like 600 watts carrier(deadkey,rms, or whatever you prefer to call it), so you'd want to go bigger between that 1600v and the antenna if you like plenty of headroom, but that rating, as mentioned, is probably for higher frequencies (vhf/uhf) and has more room at hf, which is where you are. That said, one day you might want to move up and turn that 1600v into your driver and use a larger final amp. If that's the case, just spend the extra $10 and get the higher rated stuff so you're only doing it once.

You have a hefty investment there so go with a full time in line watt/swr meter, preferrabley one with a remote sensor so you can have it on the dash. I use an ameritron awm-35, it has simultaneous swr/watts and and adjustable swr warning light. Doing the "set it and forget it" deal on an expensive setup is risky if somethin goes south and you don't know it due to lack of the ability to monitor it.

-drdx

#205198

Question: What about in my case where I am running a 2 x 6.
I have 8x from the radio to the amp
RG213 from the amp to the meter
and stock wilson coax as supplied with my wilson 1000 magnet mount antenna!
I cant run "big" coax because I have to use a magnet mount antenna on my company supplied work truck. My coax has to pass through the door jam. No holes allowed.
Am I going to melt down my coax?

PONY EXPRESS · #205208

Watermelonman53 wrote:I'M GOING TO MOUNT/ INSTALL MY 2X8 IN MY 2002 379 PETERBILT SOON BUT I NEED SOMEONE WITH EXPERIENCE IN THIS TYPE INSTALL TO CONSULT WITH SO I CAN MAKE USE OF ALL THE LASTEST COAX UPGRADES,ANTENNA MOUNTING SOLUTIONS. IM INSTALLING A TEXAS STAR DX1600V .
WHAT ARE THE CURRENT ACCEPTABLE COAX CHOICES FOR THIS PROJECT?? MY RESEARCH SAYS RG-213 & LMR 400. OF THESE 2 CHOICES , WHICH IS MORE PLYABLE/ BENDABLE OR MANAGABLE TO WORK WITH?? WHICH IS THE SMALLER IN SIZE?? I HAVE BEEN USING 8X FOR YEARS ON MY 1X4 AND EVEN MY OLD 1X6.

Hummm since there is no mention of double shielded RG 214 U

LMR 400 SUPER FLEX would be my vote and use that in my little car. RG 213 will still do you a very nice job as will
RG 214u which is double shielded coax. [Please login or register to view this link]
My pickup truck and my wifes vehicle we run 1/2 flex hardline but that is doing serious stuff on the ham bands.... :D

wegarrett · #205210

im running a 3x8 and the 8 pill on 17 voltz and i run 213.......LMR400 iz great coax
if you get the superflex you canroute it in a truck if itz got the solid core itz guna be
almost impossible to route in your largecar.......213 iz sufficient enuff feedline for
running your 2x8 and you shouldnt have any problems

#205211

belden 9913f7 ......2 more center strand than the rg 8 or 213.......less loss......waay more easy to wotk than lmr 400

#205244

WOW ....THANKS FOR THAT INFORMATION LONESOME 500.....CANT SAY I EVER HEARD OF THAT NUMBER BEFORE. BUT I'M GONNA CHECK IT OUT.

#205245

in my burban i had 217,talk about some extra stiff coax,but i would use 213 watermelon.

'Doc · #205248

HOUND DOG,
For what it's worth, the limiting factors are the original coax supplied with that antenna, and the fact that the antenna is mag-mounted. Where the stuff goes through the door is a very potential problem point, I haven't seen it done where the coax isn't deformed at least a little bit, and that's not good.
Like it or not, mag-mounted antennas are limited in what they can handle. Those magnets are providing an indirect connection to ground, the vehicle's body (and the 'dirt' under it). It acts like a capacitor, one plate being the magnets, the other plate being the body. Whatever is between those two plates is subjected to to pretty fierce voltage/current at times depending on the power levels. What's the break-down voltage of the wax/paint/etc? Beats me, I've no idea. (I also don't plan on finding out using my vehicle

!)
There really are 'work arounds' to that going through the door jams and mag-mounts. Probably not as simple, but certainly not impossible either. I'd be willing to bet that you could find a 'hole' in the cab of that truck to run coax through. There are also other methods of mounting antennas besides magnets that don't leave holes. I'd really think about that if you're going to run power.
- 'Doc

linearone · #205263

pfft. use rg8x, rg8, rg213... any of those will work, you are only going to get 600-800 avg and thats only on peaks.
its more important to use nice new coax with ends that are soldered on correctly rather than the old clear coax you found under the trailer with green corrosion in the braid.

#205333

OK ......THANKS FOR THE ADDITIONAL INFORMATION GUYS .

LET ME SAY THAT THIS ISNT MY FIRST AMP. I'VE BEEN RUNNING THEM FOREVER. I HAVE RUN BIG TUBE BOXES IN THE PAST. ALSO SOME 5PILL BUT THIS IS THE FIRST OF THIS SIZE (2X8) I'VE RUN AND JUST WAS WONDERING IF I SHOULD UPGRADE FROM THE 8X THAT I CURRENTLY RUN. OF COURSE I WILL RUN ALL FRESH STUFF THROUGHOUT AS I THINK COAX IS LIKE OIL IN YOUR MOTOR AFTER A PERIOD OF USE IT WILL START TO BREAK DOWN ON YA!

DOC- THANKYOU FOR SHARING YOUR INFO ON THE MAG MOUNTS. NO NEED TO WORRY ABOUT ANY MAG MOUNT STUFF HERE .ACTUALLY THE ONLY MAGNETS I USE ARE A FEW TO HOLD GROCERY LIST AND SUCH ON THE REFRIGERATOR . IF I WAS TO USE ONE IT WOULD BE A TRI-MOUNT WITH ITS OWN PL-259 CONNECTORS ON IT AND NOT CLOSE TO THE COAX

linearone · #205356

i know no one here wants to hear it but 8x will work and be ok. rg8 is better and rg 213 is better still, if you can afford to I always use the best i can aford so gi get some 213 and you will rest easy at night knowing its there

721HACKSAW · #205364

Times Microwave LMR-400 in the Standard and the Ultra Flex is the best coax I have ever worked with. I haven't used any on a mobile setup but my base setup uses the UF for the beam and all jumpers, the standard goes to my Imax. It is a much better product in my opinion.

#205438

IM GOING TO USE SOME 213 OR ULTRA-FLEX FROM THE ANTENNA BACK TO THE AMP AND SOME FRESH FEED LINE BUT PERHAPS A BIT LIGHTER IN GAUGE. I JUST WANTED TO BE SURE AS TO MY NEEDING OR NOT NEEDING TO HAVE A MINIMUM REQUIREMENT FOR THAT 2X8 AMP.

rowddy · #205442

Jeez after reading all this I'm glad that went with the 213. And I'm not running any power compared too you guy's

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NEED SOME COAX ADVICE ON A 2X8 INSTALL PLEASE

NEED SOME COAX ADVICE ON A 2X8 INSTALL PLEASE

RE NEED SOME COAX ADVICE ON A 2X8 INSTALL PLEASE